Cynthia D. Trowbridge Awhile back, someone was asking about the appearance of juvenile sea stars (aka starfish). I just came across a photo of several species together. This was based from an experiment that I did (a decade ago) to see if sea star juveniles would eat recently metamorphosed Elysia viridis (sacoglossan gastropods). Sea stars included Marthasterias, Asterina, and Asterias. The answer was no but I do not think I ever published it. I surveyed about 15 taxa of inverts and several fish species.
John de Jong Checking some old picures, and noticed the juvenile Elysia viridis on these.....Didn't noticed it before. Shot at Sint Annaland, Oosterschelde in 2011 with olympus E330 and 50mm macro lens.
O Gajo Dos Olivais hhehehehe uninvited nudi. Always a nice find! :)
Cláudio Brandão Although it is not a nudibranch, it is a very familiar animal to me! I have done some scientific research with them! =) Nice pic
Andy Horton I have found this small sea hare where there is no known Codium (on the shore of Sussex). Does this mean I have missed the Codium or do they feed on other microalgae?
Cynthia D. Trowbridge they eat red algae (at least 3 genera) and green algae (5-6 genera) so Codium is not essential
Cynthia D. Trowbridge So Andy, Chaetomorpha, Cladophora, Bryopsis, Derbesia, Codium, Griffithsia, Halurus, & Dasya...:-)
Andy Horton http://www.conchsoc.org/spAccount/elysia-viridis
Andy Horton It is warm in England and the middle of the night and I cannot sleep, so: http://www.seaslugforum.net/find/1175
Henrik Adelborg They are indeed everywhere, now we have them in Australia, Denmark and Dutch.
John de Jong They travel a lot, Hendrik ;-)
Henrik Adelborg Yes it must be said.
Frank van Klaveren Hi John, can you please share your settings with us? As a Dutch -Brabant- Diver too, I am more than interested. :-)
Alistair Merrifield Thanks, Frank van Klaveren.
John de Jong I have to check it, Frank van Klaveren. I will upload the information this evening.(On my homepage the exif information is automatically displayed, on Facebook I am not yet used to enter it in the text...)
Chris Wood Spring Surveys underway at last
The May 18th/19th weekend was a good one for survey diving for some. In Devon Seasearch visited 4 sites east of Plymouth, Blackstone Point, Stoke Point, East Rutts and Prawle Point, with 10m visibility at three of them and a thick mid-water layer of plankton at the fourth. In North Wales Seasearch visited Bardsey Island and there were also dives taking place in Poole Bay and West Pembrokeshire.
The sea temperature in Devon has finally reached double figures after being a couple of degrees below normal thoughout March, April and the beginning of May.
Spring is the best time of year to observe many of the hydroids and the nudibranchs feeding on them. Below are dense oaten pipe hydroids from East Rutts Devon (my picture), and a pair of anemone eating Aeoilid nudibranchs from Sussex (photo Neil Watson).
Please add your Sewasearch Survey news here to enthuse the rest of us.
There are still places available on many of the Seasearch Surveys dives over the summer. See the full list on the Diving page of the Seasearch website. There are often spaces at the last minute so even if you find the event is currnetly full do ask to be put on the waiting list.
Kirstie Harris Helen and I dived at Andurn Point near Bovisand on Saturday, as our first survey dive after the Surveyor course on 11/12 May. Visibility was a good 6m, the site was covered with lots of different types of seaweed, and I found 3 Elysia viridis :)
Charlotte Bolton DWT had a glorious weekend on Mike Markey's boat Peveril Myth, made it round the corner to Dancing Ledge in bright sunshine (above) and 5m+ viz (below); more of the same on Sunday plus added dolphins...
Paula Lightfoot Scarborough Sub Aqua Club had a great trip to Cornwall on the bank holiday weekend and we completed Survey forms for 7 sites. The viz hasn't really cleared up here in NE England yet, but we did have a fun if rather bumpy dive at the Farnes in April!
David Fenwick Snr Can anyone explain what's going on here with this sea slug egg. Elysia viridis and Facelina auriculata were on the rock and the egg was similar to others with E. viridis. It's the orange dotted transparent area at the 11 o'clock position that I'm interested in, seems strange for it to have come from an Elysia.
David Fenwick Snr It's almost as if a small Limacia clavigera was caught on the egg as the tide went out but it seems too transparent for that.
David Kipling Semi-transparent blob with yellow dots ... if it's a nudi, how about one of the Polyceras or Ancula gibbosa? Not sure if you get them that shallow.
David Fenwick Snr Yes both recorded shallow here so very possible.
Christian Skauge Colorwise it looks like it could be an Onchidoris luteocincta :-)
David Kipling I see what you mean - there's a little red mark. Is this part of the animal David (as opposed to being underneath or a bit of stray red weed)?
David Fenwick Snr The redness appears to be part of the animal but I cannot be sure; the spotting is on the surface the red below. The surface of the animal appears to be finely granular. Will add another image.
David Kipling Ancula is found close to Bottrylus ascidians according to habitas, so would be right for the sort of things you get under rocks. It also has a circular spawn by the look of it from Bernard's picture. Perhaps those are actually its eggs?
http://www.habitas.org.uk/marinelife/photo.asp?item=bep2_3285
David Fenwick Snr There wasn't a lot about on the habitat yesterday, pretty low diversity, the reason I kept an eye open for slugs was that there was quite a bit of Alcyonidium gelatinosum about and I found the Elysia and Facelina soon after discovering it. Just a pity I didn't actually see the small slug on the egg mass to get it in water to photograph. Yes ascidians about but no large masses of them seen. So could we be dealing with a spent slug after it has laid?
Cynthia D. Trowbridge Does anyone have any idea what flatworms would occur around sea urchin burrows (western Ireland)? I thought perhaps they were commensals or parasites but found no evidence in the urchins I checked. The worms were present in multiple years at the same site. I could not find anything in the literature or from US experts I asked.
Jean Michel Crouzet hello cynthia i am not sure it s flat worms its possible opistobranch limapontia or runcina (sorry for my english i am french divers)
Marco Faasse Interesting ... Any close-up pics?
Brendan Oonk Could there be a connection with the spounge they are on?
Jean Michel Crouzet it's not a sponge it 's calcareous algae and this opistho is eating it
Marco Faasse Apparently Jean Michel Crouzet thinks it may be Runcina, known to occur in coralline rockpools: http://www.marlin.ac.uk/speciesinformation.php?speciesID=4267
Brendan Oonk Does Limapontia eat anything else than green algea (Vaucheria)?
Jean Michel Crouzet i dont no, in Groix where i dive i dont have limapontia and i never saw it but i thinck it is possible; cynthia did you saw on the algae some tracks who loock like little road
Marco Faasse Limapontia species are reported to feed upon green algae, but Runcina is said to graze upon encrusting coralline algae (Lithothamnium): http://www.conchsoc.org/MolluscWorld24/4 ... interesting habit ...
Cynthia D. Trowbridge Thanks for your thoughts. As I am a sacoglossan ecologist and phycologist, I can assure you the species was not Limapontia and there was no Vaucheria or green algae in sight....just coralline algae, urchins, and Codium spp. As I have cultured Elysia viridis through its life cycle, I know these were not juvenile Elysia.
I am interested in the suggestion of Runcina. I am familiar with the genus as I rediscovered Runcina macfarlandi on the west coast (and sent specimens to Terry Gosliner to report). But I do think it was too flat to be Runcina.
I was with 2 invertebrate students and they both thought it was a flatworm species as well. We were thinking about our Pacific Syndesmis or Synsisyrinx spp. associated with urchins and asked US taxonomists if there was an Atlantic counterpart. I am sorry that I have no close-ups. I collected a bunch and tried to bring them home for microscope work but they did not make it....
If anyone has further thoughts, it would be great. Otherwise I will just have to go back to try to recollect when I am in Ireland this fall :-)
Cynthia D. Trowbridge Perhaps I will say Runcina and/or flatworm until the mystery is solved :-) THANKS!
Ian Smith My first thought was Runcina coronata, but, though it has yellow/tan in close up, it usually appears black-brown in pools. See images at http://www.conchsoc.org/spAccount/runcina-coronata . Cynthia, when was the image taken? Runcina is abundant in coralline pools in April and September, but too small to find easily in June (in my experience - Portland Bill, LlÅ·n peninsula & Anglesey)
Cynthia D. Trowbridge It was tan closeup (field lens) but dark in pools. I visited the same site (Spanish Point near Lahinch, western Ireland) in mid September each year.
Cynthia D. Trowbridge By the way, I have lots of gastropod records from Scotland and Ireland. I sent some sacoglossan records to Julia Nunn a few years ago. If the conchology society collects records still, I would be happy to send ones as I bring under grad and postgrad students over to Ireland every fall.
Ian Smith Cynthia D. Trowbridge your September visits are right for seeing lots of Runcina, so I think it the likely answer. Lucas CerCur posted that he thinks the Runcinas need attention - you never know, the W. of Ireland may have another sp.
Ian Smith Simon Taylor is just getting into harness as our new Conch Soc Marine Recorder. I hope he picks up on your kind offer of records.
Simon Taylor Hi Cynthia - yes I'd be delighted to receive any records you were willing to send and to add them to the Conchological Society's dataset, which is regularly uploaded to NBN.
Cynthia D. Trowbridge Will do :-) We do not due such things in the US...a huge mistake!
Anne Bunker These tiny pink animals were found in Pembrokeshire on 21 September (Natural Resources Wales intertidal survey). The largest is approximately 3mm long.
Mid shore rock pools on crustose coralline algae. Exposed shore (Pen y holt).
We found them in the same rockpools 3 years ago.
Can you help with identification please?
João Pedro Silva Limapontia sp. perhaps?
Christian Skauge Tiny Elysia viridis?
Peter H van Bragt Can you post a cropped, enlarged specimen. I think I see folded parapodia. Could be juv. Seahares??????
Christian Skauge Here's one, Peter H van Bragt. This is what made me think E. viridis - same basic bodyshape and spots on the back ;-)
Peter H van Bragt No rhinophores, so Elysia and seahare don't seem to be an option.
Jan Light Would the rhinophores be developed on such a young specimen?
Ian Smith Rhinophores appear at 3mm on Elysia. I guess Anne 's slugs are bigger, perhaps she could say? See http://www.conchsoc.org/node/5610 (Later edit; I see Anne said largest 3mm.)
Ian Smith Coralline pools on exposed shores have some real surprises. Runcina coronata can be abundant, and has some golden brown in good light, but the shape of these isn't right for it. The slugs shown have a rotundity with some whitish colour; I think this could be an internal shell showing through the mantle. All have a truncate end which, on those turned at the right angle, suggests the cylindrical posterior of the mantle covering the shell, as on Philine punctata http://www.conchsoc.org/spAccount/philine-punctata Christian's crop seems to show parapodia and a thin anterior without any features. The nearest fit to all this; structure, colour and occurrence in tidal pools, in Thompson Opisth Biol vol1 is Philine catena, max length 6-7mm, an uncommon and little-known species. Just a suggestion, but an exciting find whatever it proves to be.
Keith Hiscock Look like Runcina coronata to me. Rarely see them. Last time was at Pendennis Point, Falmouth in May.
Ian SmithRuncina coronata images at http://www.conchsoc.org/spAccount/runcina-coronata Frequent in coralline pools on exposed coast, and the obvious candidate. A good chance that Keith is right, but as I said above, Anne's look different structurally as far as can tell from image. Well worth further investigation.
Jan Light I know Runcina coronate, these animals are not that.
Ian Smith The more I look at the images, the more I'm inclined to reconsider Jan's idea of Elysia viridis before rhinophore development. The general shape is very like the juvenile Elysia image above. I think I MAY be able to make out stumpy early rhinophores on some of them - if only the images were clearer. Pink body Elysia would be expected on pink weed BUT it feeds by piercing individual cells of large celled weeds; do the juveniles have a feeding mechanism that can utilise encrusting Corallina ?? Intriguing.
Anne Bunker They were only on the encrusting coralline algae although there were a lot of other algae in the pools. I brought one back to examine under the microscope but I'm sorry to say that it died and became an amorphous mass about 2 seconds after I turned the microscope light on.
Keith Hiscock This is my pic. of Runcina coronata at Pendennis Point - any comments on confirmation/correction welcome.
Lucas CerCur Or...Runcina ornata
Lucas CerCur Runcina.....another European opisthobranch mess that should be solved.
Ian Smith I agree Keith; typical R. coronata, or whatever it turns out to be when the "mess" is sorted. I've found it in thousands in a single HW pool on exposed coast Anglesey, hundreds in pools at HW on fairly exposed shore Lleyn Peninsula, several in virtually every pool near HW on tip of Portland Bill. Several other records on NBN are from exposed coast. However I've also found it at LWS on sheltered sites such as inner Bay of Firth near Finstown in Orkney and a sheltered LWS pool in Lleyn. It's seasonal; the pool in Anglesey had none findable on a September visit. Could be that the exposed / sheltered ones are different segregates, but they all looked the same. If all one sp. I think it is catholic, but overlooked because of small size except when on contrasting substrate, such as encrusting coralline.
Lucas CerCur I consider (in this moment) that in UK there are 3 species of this genus, i.e. R. coronata, R. ornata and R. ferruginea. But, I think that a deep study should be carried around all Europe.
Ian Smith Lucas, can you tell us how to separate the three spp. morphologically and/or direct us to images on the web?
Lucas CerCur Even if in 2001 and 2002 two relevant contributions were published by Schmekel and Cappellato and several Mediterranean new species were described, all photos were in black snd white and many of non living material and both papers are based on anatomy and morphology.
Ian Smith Can you give us the references? Did they include British material? I'm aware that the Med. has more spp. from viewing Bill Rudman's Seaslug forum.
Lucas CerCur R. ferruginea is very easy, since it is reddish. The remaing two could be more complicate. In general, the typical R. coronata has two more or less evident white arches (half-collar), one below the head and the other before the end of the notum. Moreover, there are a lot of withish and very Little White punctuadion over the notum. R. ornata is like the Keith's photo.
Ian Smith Above, in this string of messages, I hazarded the possibility of Philine catena. By coincidence a friend has sent me a series of images of it from Croatia. None of them hold themselves in a tapered position; all have the wide truncated end shown in this image. So I think my suggestion should be dismissed. It looks as if young Elysia are the best bet.
David Fenwick Snr Is it possible to identify this egg mass, was found under a rock on the lowershore at Little London reef, Marazion, Cornwall. 24.08.13. Thanks.
Erling Svensen Looks like Flabellina verrucosa for me.
David KiplingTritonia lineata does nice little spirals too, but then again I think a few other species will...
Arne Kuilman Get this card or ask them: https://www.facebook.com/ZoekkaartNederlandseZeenaaktslakken I've got one at home and will have a look for you later.
Brendan Oonk I don't think yoy will find it on that card Arne. These eggs don't look like they are by a species of nudi that lives in The Netherlands...
Arne Kuilman It's not on the chart indeed )-: circlewise it's kind of like Elysia eggs.
João Pedro Silva The eggs I've found from Elysia viridis were much smaller: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jpsilva1971/7741931486/
Arne Kuilman I meant look like. Elysian doesn't lay under rocks, just the spiral pattern
Erling Svensen Looks like these...... http://uwphoto.no/shopexd.asp?id=14044
Brendan Oonk Erling is that the reason you said they were Flabelina verucosa eggs ;)
Erling Svensen Yes, it is. They are quite typical in the outher edge, so for me they looks quite F. verrucosa like.
Erling Svensen In winter we have millions of F. verrucosa, the most common nudi in Egersund and Stavanger. And lots of eggs.
Bernard Picton Cornwall is too far south for F. verrucosa. On the other hand I don't know these eggs I'm afraid. Aeolidiella glauca does lay a straight spiral a bit like this.
Brendan Oonk It is not A. glauca.
Erling Svensen Could be this verrucosa think it is too cold here up in the North and will expand the summer by mooving South?
Brendan Oonk Here you can see A.glauca + eggs
http://www.natuurbericht.nl/?id=2727
David Fenwick Snr I'm still trying to find a sea slug to match up with it at the moment but nudibranchs seem few and far between at the moment. The only sea slug found today was a 2mm Palio nothus, a sea slug that has consistantly turned up for us throughout the year this year.
David Fenwick Snr Another image of A. glauca. http://www.conchsoc.org/node/5853
David Kipling https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=332958726789556&set=oa.266943763416911&type=3&theater
David Kipling T. lineata caught laying eggs like this ...
David Fenwick Snr Can only find on record of this species for Cornwall David and it was for 3-4 miles offshore. Going to have to keep my eyes open if it is this species.
David Kipling Really? Common as muck up here (albeit Skomer is more sediment-rich and T lineata seems to thrive here). Let me have a look to see whether it's in my Cornish albums, perhaps it doesn't like the clear water down with you ...
Becky Hitchin Stop bragging! :P
David Kipling That's why it's a MNR ;) Biodiversity hotspot!
Terry Griffiths And a few around Torquay.
Bernard Picton Great photo David Kipling! I've never seen T. lineata spawn but it is a good match. They are not normally found on shore in my experience so altogether some interesting observations in this thread.
David Fenwick Snr Found this one today, north of the Cressars Reef, Penzance, Cornwall, under a rock on mixed / sandy ground. Extreme lowershore. I know there's people here far better than I am at these. Help would be most appreciated. Thanks.
David Fenwick Snr Species was about 10mm, it was sharing the same rock with egg laying Elysia viridis, and not a Codium in sight!
João Pedro SilvaFacelina auriculata
David Fenwick Snr Much appreciated Joao. Thank you.
João Pedro Silva You're welcome, David! Some animals with less white stripes and dots on the cerata may be more difficult to differenciate from F. bostoniensis but this one appears to be more straightforward.
David Fenwick Snr Yes I realise Facelina can be tricky, thanks for the explanation; it's only the second of the genus I've found in four years, don't see them that often at all.
David Fenwick Snr Is this var. coronata?
João Pedro Silva I've never seen var. curta so I just use plain F. auriculata.
You should be also be able to see F. annulicornis which is very frequent here in Portugal during the summer:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jpsilva1971/7651793316/
João Pedro Silva Isn't F. auriculata var curta = F. bostoniensis?
David Fenwick Snr I don't know, I just looked at the Marlin website to get more info. on the species and found it describes two vars. http://www.marlin.ac.uk/speciesinformation.php?speciesID=3332#
João Pedro Silva Take a look at the synonyms for F. bostoniensis at the Marlin website: http://www.marlin.ac.uk/speciesinformation.php?speciesID=4645
João Pedro Silva Habitas doesn't mention two vars because it mentions two distinct species: F. auriculata and F. bostoniensis. And it also mentions F. annulicornis:
http://www.habitas.org.uk/marinelife/species.asp?item=W15250
João Pedro Silva Did you check NBN Gateway's map?
http://www.searchnbn.net/gridMap/gridMap.jsp?allDs=1&srchSpKey=NBNSYS0000175324
David Fenwick Snr Sorted, Marlin recognise curta as F. bostoniensis http://www.marlin.ac.uk/speciesinformation.php?speciesID=4645
David Fenwick Snr I ask if the Marlin F. auriculata page can be updated
David Fenwick Snr Have just done it.
Bernard Picton Silly Marlin, this was sorted in Thompson, 1984, Biology of Opisthobranch Molluscs, vol.2 apart from the fact that coronata was used instead of auriculata as Thompson wasn't sure which var/species equated with this, the oldest name. I still have reservations about using the name bostoniensis, it would be nice to get samples for DNA to see how far apart the Boston ones are from the NE Atlantic ones, or whether populations in Iceland and Greenland are maintaining a genetic continuity.
Paula Lightfoot Are these Placida dendritica? Taken yesterday at Grandes Rocques on the west coast of Guernsey.
Paula Lightfoot Actually this was taken on today's dive - I'm getting my days mixed up!
Kate Lock wow that is what I call serious camouflage!
Cynthia D. Trowbridge Yes, these are specimens of Placida dendritica :-)
Cynthia D. Trowbridge Beautiful photograph as well
Rudolf Svensen Lucky you. I have been searching for those but with no luck so far. Nice photo.
Pippa Swannell Great pic. Is the algae Codium fragile? I see Elysia viridis all the time on Codium in Devon but could I find this beauty if I look harder?
Erling Svensen They are quite common in Stavanger where Rudolf live.... ;-)
Rudolf Svensen Never seen them and I have been looking for a long time, but one day I'll find them.
Paula Lightfoot Thanks to everyone who sent photos for the Name a Species competition - some photos have been used on the Guardian website and others are on posters to promote the competition at events around the country. The competition is now 'live' so send in your suggested names for the 5 marine species and 5 terrestrial species! http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/series/name-a-species
Keith Hiscock I have e-mailed to ask that the "very small cushion star" description next to Akera bullata is 'pulled'.
Paula Lightfoot Oh dear! There was a last-minute decision to remove Asterina phylactica from the competition as it was suggested that it already had a common name - it looks as if the accompanying text has not been properly updated.
David Fenwick Snr Paula Akera bullata also has a published common name, the Soft bubble-shell (Shell Life by Edward Step)
David Fenwick Snr Similarly Elysia viridis is published in Step as the Green Elysia
Paula Lightfoot Aaargh! Thanks for letting me know, I've passed the information along. Loads of creatures were rejected on the grounds that they already had common names published somewhere, I guess these slipped through. I think they will stay in now that the competition has gone live, it's still a great way to raise public interest in biodiversity. Anyway 'green elysia' might be a correct translation of the Latin but the only one I saw in Yorkshire wasn't green at all but dark red! Let's see if the public can come up with something better! ;-)
David Fenwick Snr I wouldn't have noticed but have recently gone through certain molluscs with a fine toothed comb as I've just increased the number of species on my website to about 400. Have been looking at common names as many old ones for shells have somewhat gone out of fashion. My own opinion is that adding common names personalises a species and makes biodiversity and relationships between species somewhat easier for the masses to comprehend. Working out the common names from the scientific synonomy has been quite tasking at times.
Penny Martin Akra bullata swimming http://www.flickr.com/photos/65618324@N07/6208169487/
Bernard Picton Jan Light The Conchological Society has just uploaded its Elysia viridis page on its website. Does anyone have details of a source evidence saying exactly how the sequestered chloroplasts benefit the slug? The assumption is, we think, that it's sugars/energy from photosynthesis, but has this been demonstrated?
Christian Skauge I think getting touch with Jussi Evertsen on this might be an idea. I believe he's done some research on that :-)
Becky SeeleyElysia viridis from yesterday's MBA Cawsand Bioblitz. Full report to follow but current species total stands at 867 species with a few more record forms still to go in the database. Thank you so much to everyone who came and worked really hard throughout the survey. We were thrilled everyone could appreciate a rare sighting of the sun on sunday.
João Pedro Silva Ah, now I see it! You can only see the head and the rhinophores and part of the parapodia of this Elysia viridis!
João Pedro Silva Did you spot it while shooting or only after seen the photo on the computer screen? I've gathered a few dozens of what I call "uninvited guest" photos. The most dramatic find was of a Cuthona caerulea on a photo of a Flabellina babai... and it was found two and a half years after the shot was taken :)
João Pedro Silva This is my "uninvited guests" set on Flickr. Many nudibranchs but also parasites, copepods, shrimp, etc:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jpsilva1971/sets/72157625904859297/with/4767925310/